A Visitor From The Past by Thelen Paulk

Note: I could take or leave all the "Religious" mumbo jumbo and "Christian Values" it talks about. I'm not that religious. Still, when it comes to our constitutional rights and what's become of our so called Government, I think this poem has a lot of meaning.

It's all about 'numbers'.

Simple fact...no guns...no shootings.

Few guns....few shootings...

Lots of guns....America.

The US has the second highest gun ownership on the planet.

Probably more people [US] die at home from shootings than do US soldiers in Iraq.

Safer to enlist?...or patently absurd?

The REALLY stupid/scary bit is the sort of guns people can have.

Who the hell needs a 50 cal machine gun?  [other than some third world coup leader].

"Honey...just gonna go bag me some rabbits fer stew...."  "Gonna take the 50?"  "Nah...got me a M61 off the old rusty bird out back....them 20mm shells will fillet them varmits at 6000 rounds per minute......sounds like a fart, tho...it shoots so durn quick".

That's the only part of your reply I don't agree with. We've had WAY more fatalities from war since we got involved in the middle east during Desert Storm and up to now than we've had in the last 10 years from "Accidental Shootings". Note that I say ACCIDENTAL Shootings. I think in this argument "Gun Crime" shouldn't be considered as we're talking about people who Legally Own Guns and not criminals with illegal guns.

The only people I feel sorry for are the people who loose a child because they were too stupid to keep their gun put up correctly. If you follow some common safety tips when owning a gun there's really No Excuse in my eyes for a "Accidental Shooting" to take place. You keep the gun locked in a Gun Cabinet and you keep the ammo locked in a container in the garage. Then you don't tell the kids where the keys are or you only have 1 key and you keep it in your wallet at all times. Problem solved, and little Timmy doesn't accidentally blow his little sister's brains all over the wall.

When it comes to Illegal Gun Crime, that's going to happen anywhere in the world you go. Let's take China for instance. There are more people in China than in the United States. Simply on a percentage base that means China has more criminals than the US does. China also has a "Mafia" style crime syndicate all it's own. Almost all of them own a gun or have access to one through black market connections. I'd guess they have just as much if not more gun crime in China than we do here in the US. The only difference is the US puts it's statistics out there for the whole world to see and compare too, China doesn't, or at least if they do they damn sure aren't being truthful about the numbers.

Then again China also has a totally different value on Human Life than America does. In China if the government wants to build a dam that will flood the area where half a million people have their homes, they MAKE those people move whether they can afford too or not. Actually China is doing that Exact Thing right now. China is in the middle of building the Largest Dam in the World and in the process they've had to relocate millions of peasants. While China does have large and modern cities it also still has small villages with no electricity and no indoor plumbing, though those places are rare they Do still exist in China. Some people have chosen to live the way their ancestors did and they have very little contact with modern technology unless someone brings the technology to them.

It's part of the US Constitution that we the people have the right to bare arms, and by "bare arms" I mean own guns, not walk around with our shirts off. This is one of the ideas our country was founded on. This was decided upon because back in those days everyone Needed a gun, if not for hunting food then for self protection and the protection of your family. We didn't have "Police" back in the 1700's.

It was also decided to be necessary to keep the government in check. If everyone in the country has a gun then the government can't have Absolute power because if they get out of line the people can stand up and Fight Back if need be. Jafo, you're in Australia right? What would you do if some kind of messed up shit went down and your government suddenly started treating you all like slaves and the Australian people were forced to the point of having to overthrow the government? How would you even attempt to overthrow a modern military power without weapons? This, in theory, and because we're *free* is why Americans are allowed to buy whatever kinds of guns they want if they can get the right permits. Some more dangerous guns ARE being outlawed though, and for good reason.

Do I think every American should have the right to own a gun? Yes.

Do I think every American should be walking around with Fully Automatic Weapons? No.

Common sense is used for the most part, but the argument all comes down to whether or not we're really free. In a free society anyone should be able to buy whatever they want if they can afford to. Of course some things need to be controlled. Look at Jet-Packs. What would ANY COUNTRY be like if EVERYONE owned a Jet-Pack? It would be Mass Chaos!!! So, some common sense and form of moderate control is needed. The same thing applies with fire-arms.

 

Legally, we can't own fully automatic weapons, not to mention 50Cal. rounds are about $12 dollars a piece if you can find them. The general believe at the time of the addition of the 2nd amendment was that government should fear the people, not the other way around. Much has changed since then in the distance and power of weapons, thus the debate we see every election cycle. I don't have a carry permit, or own a handgun, but kick in my door unannounced and you better be quick! Law Enforcement Officers even have the since to knock and announce themselves before coming in. Criminal home invaders don't, and generally wait till you are not home at least where I live. And to reiterate a point if I depend on the police when the shit hits the fan would mean you would be reading about me in the Obits. the next morning

But that's what ya need when huntin politician varmints!   And that's small consider what we're up against should a full fledged revolt break out!

I hope the wording is 'bear arms' ......;p

Not gonna bother with this debate...it's been done to death....more deaths than the US sees by them.

But....qualifying my statement by only considering ACCIDENTAL shootings is...."Lies, damn lies and statistics".

You can 'spin' anything to make it look good.

Simple maths...

US population / deaths by shooting = x

AUS population / deaths by shooting = y  [AUS as example only]

x > y

END of argument.

 

Ahh but see, now you're simplifying the argument way too much. There is a difference between violent gun crime and otherwise somehow fatal shootings. Every country on Earth has violent gun crimes, even the countries that don't let their people legally own guns.

It was "bear arms" btw. That's what happens when I've been awake all night and all day. Whole word typos incoming!!! LoL

Death by gun.

Use that as the ONLY LEGITIMATE criterium for comparison.

I am not the one qualifying motives/mitigations/excuses for how or why someone is shot.

The dead don't care why.

It is still a reality that no matter how you want to dismiss some deaths as 'oops...sorry' the % of people in the US who die by gun is higher than elsewhere....[except, I think...Denmark who coincidentally [not] has the highest gun ownership].

You can't use it if you haven't got it.

Well, the problem is Raven X that even though the constitution gives us the right to bear arms, the average person bearing those arms in this country is an idiot or a crazed lunatic.  People should only own guns if the need them for their job, or to hunt to feed their family.  There are no other valid reasons to own a gun IMO, personal protection included.  Sure would cut down on all these accidental shootings and such!

"The right of the people to bear arms shall not be abridged." There are some who'd say Cheney and people are two different things, though I'm not sure that hunting with Cheney would be any more dangerous than going for a drive with Teddy (while he was alive).

 

 

 

Oh wouldn't I just love to turn you into a petite 5', 102-lb woman working the night shift in the inner city, with a statement like that.

You're not an easy target, Tom, so you wouldn't know what it's like to be vulnerable and NEED personal protection.  For those that DO need personal protection, just knowing it's there if they need it, gives them enough confidence to walk down the street not looking like a lame duck.

I'm by no means a gun enthusiast, don't own them myself, don't see the need, since when I DO walk down the street, I have my 80-lb pitbull with me, so I don't look like an easy mark, but I have a handful of friends, one man included, who wouldn't be alive today if they hadn't been armed and had their concealed carry permits.

Aside from personal protection, guns are also good assets to invest your money in; they're more liquid than fine art, so if the economy every totally tanked, they can be liquidated to pay for necessities; they don't usually lose their value.

Why don't we quit pussyfooting around and just make an intelligence test before a person can procreate -- the problem isn't guns...the problem is too many stupid people breeding.

 

In the long run Karen, I totally agree with you on that one. 

we aussies ended up banning guns because of some pyscho who went on a shooting rampage in tasmania, killing way too many innocent people for nothing......i really hate guns, i wont even touch one.

Im glad we banned them.....im sorry, but that is just how I feel.

......and guns are the cure.

With luck the idiots will do their own cull....;)

Yeah, Kitty, we'll see how you feel when Zombie outbreak happens in Oz.

No, but seriously, the problem with banning them is that then only the criminals own them -- violent people who don't care about the law will find access to the things they want regardless of whether they're banned.  BECAUSE they're banned (in short supply), there will be a great demand for them, and dealing them illegally will be a very lucrative business, making it an attractive business for the worst sorts of human beings.  In that situation, you have a population of thugs and scumbags who are armed and regular, law-abiding citizens are at their mercy in a dark alley.

Prohibition does NOT work -- it didn't work with alcohol, it doesn't work with drugs, and it's not going to work with guns.  Criminals will always find a way to acquire the things they want; legislating things means control over things.  As long as guns are legislated, they cannot be legally sold to children, there's a way to keep track of who buys them, they're TAXED...it's not a perfect setup, but it really does beat the alternative.  OK, so accidents happen...people are ignorant and don't take the proper precautions, they don't take the time to educate the people in their household about how to show proper respect for these things, and tragedy happens.  But tragedy happens twice as more in the United States through traffic accidents than by gun fatalities (and cardiovascular disease tops both of those, and nobody has regulated hamburgers yet).

 

Why? So many people seem to get a bang out of them.

 

 

From your mouth to G-d's ear. Unfortunately they seem to cull kill others too. Unfortunately we can't get them all together in one place and yell, "Fire!" and hope they do.

k10w3.. your my hero..