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[MOD] Distant Stars - Rebellion Alpha 0.13 Released! [17/06/13]

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Nacey
StarFallArmada
Join Date 02/2008
+7
Reply #7901 October 18, 2012 7:17:52 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

That one above is just a thumbs up to distant stars. Desktop I made for myself since I was so fond of the loading screens from DS

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Nacey
Ryat
Join Date 06/2006
+429
Reply #7902 October 18, 2012 10:55:17 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Nice

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Nacey
Liondrome
Join Date 07/2012
+2
Reply #7903 October 19, 2012 1:39:46 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Stant123,
reply 7898
Already checked the link the first time and had no issues.


Quoting Liondrome, reply 7896It says "click here to download your attacement" and the download link contains the same page link.


Quoting Stant123, reply 7892click on the HERE in "Click here to download your attachment."

And yet, when I click on it (not even logged into my account, using a friend's laptop, I get a downloaded file called "DS Update.rar" just like I expect.

 

I think what the problem is, is that you're logged onto google yourself and the link you're ending up at is trying to access my files as if you were me, which obviously, you can't do.

The link that I posted is http://sites.google.com/site/steelers086/gamefiles/DS%20Update.rar

not https://sites.google.com/site/steelers086/gamefiles/DS%20Update.rar?attredirects=0

The first being a public link, the one you posted being a secure connection (notice the the https in yours, and the lack of a redirect count in mine?) which happens after you've logged in.  Copy the first link (the public, non secure address) paste it into your address bar, and hit enter, and when you redirect to the other page with the secure connection, paste the public link back in the address bar and hit enter.  For me it starts the file download.  Another option would be to log out of google when you try.

If it still refuses to work, I'll put the file on my network hard drive for ya and PM you with instructions on how to download.  Why don't I just do that in the first place?  Because it's a huge pain in my ass to set up a file for public access on my drive and even when I do get it all set up, people usually get confused on what they have to do to get the file the first time they try which makes the whole ordeal not worth it to me, and even if that wasn't a problem, I have no way to guarantee any amount of stable connection or up time.  My router is a bitch like that sometimes.

 

Sadly it still does the same thing. :/

And thank you for the PM thing with the instructions.

 

Why not put it the same link as the current mod? Since we cant revert back to older patch so would it not be more productive to the alpha 1.4 patch on it?

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Nacey
Stant123
Join Date 02/2008
+193
Reply #7904 October 19, 2012 7:56:41 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

@StarFall, Pretty pictures.

My only criticism is that the ships/structures are known to be out of scale with each other, so any size chart built from a single in game image with the ships lined up doesn't accurately represent the size relationship that they're actually supposed to have.  Any chart made in that manner is misrepresenting the truth.  To get accurate sizes, you have to take separate images and resize them so that common features are the same size, or use screenshots from each ship in game and build a scale of the ship based on features that can have their size estimated in a fairly accurate manner as I discussed in this post last year: https://forums.sinsofasolarempire.com/409268/page/1/#2946589 and then using those scales to create true size comparisons.  You must also carry assumptions over to each ship (like the height requirement for each deck on a TEC ship) otherwise you blow your own scale apart and do a lot of work for nothing.  I know I talked about sizes in this thread in relation to present day trucks and boats, but I can't find them anymore.

I did some digging after making that post I linked to above and did find out that officially it has been stated that the smallest ship (strike craft) is 10 meters, and the largest is a kilometer in length, so that helps a lot when figuring things out.  That information was in reference to the original game and things have changed since then, especially with the inclusion of titans.

That's the biggest reason why you aren't able to find size comparison charts, no one has done the work to do an accurate job of things.

 

Quoting Liondrome,
reply 7903
Why not put it the same link as the current mod? Since we cant revert back to older patch so would it not be more productive to the alpha 1.4 patch on it?

The thing is, I don't have Rebellion, so I cannot test anything I release, and thus release them as unofficial/use at your own risk.  If it works, great, if not, I tried, and someone else can use what I've done to make something that does work...  There is no official update until Nacey gets around to it whenever that is.  We're all real busy people in real life so these things take awhile, especially when there is an available working solution.  Another issue is the fact that since my update appears to work for more people then it doesn't, more effort is being put into the Beta build which is actually for Rebellion, rather then the Alpha builds, which is a port over from Diplomacy which creates lots of broken things in Rebellion.  So you're really left with a choice, beg for more official alpha updates, or let me worry about those and release unofficial ones while those team members that do have Rebellion work on the internal alpha which will become the public beta once they're happy with it.

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Nacey
StarFallArmada
Join Date 02/2008
+7
Reply #7905 October 19, 2012 10:52:50 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

I was not aware of any idea that the ships were not to scale in game. What is your source that how they apear in game in relation to eachother is not accurate? I mean obviosly they are off scale with the planets, but comparing how they appear in game to the cinimatic made for the rebbelion intro, they seem to match pretty well. In the cinimatic they look about on scale to how they are in game, and given that the cinimatic is suposed to look like somone had a video camera at the battle, Im not sure that the scale is actualy off in game.

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Nacey
TheChronicToast
Join Date 03/2008
+67
Reply #7906 October 20, 2012 10:28:01 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting StarFallArmada,
reply 7906
I was not aware of any idea that the ships were not to scale in game. What is your source that how they apear in game in relation to eachother is not accurate? I mean obviosly they are off scale with the planets, but comparing how they appear in game to the cinimatic made for the rebbelion intro, they seem to match pretty well. In the cinimatic they look about on scale to how they are in game, and given that the cinimatic is suposed to look like somone had a video camera at the battle, Im not sure that the scale is actualy off in game.

 

If you look at the cinematic, the Colony Frigate for the TEC as it lands to pick up troops is not in scale. The windows are too tiny and it is supposed to fit many many people, not a squad of 40 crammed in on top of each other.

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Nacey
G_Bison
Join Date 02/2008
+117
Reply #7907 October 21, 2012 12:48:35 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting boshimi336,
reply 7907
If you look at the cinematic, the Colony Frigate for the TEC as it lands to pick up troops is not in scale. The windows are too tiny and it is supposed to fit many many people, not a squad of 40 crammed in on top of each other. 

Sometimes, pics do help...

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Nacey
TheChronicToast
Join Date 03/2008
+67
Reply #7908 October 21, 2012 3:24:03 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting G_Bison,
reply 7908
Sometimes, pics do help...

That is exactly the graphic I was thinking of. See how the soldiers are at least '3 windows tall'. Does not compute.

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Nacey
GoaFan77
Join Date 10/2008
+629
Reply #7909 October 21, 2012 3:30:41 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting boshimi336,
reply 7909

Quoting G_Bison, reply 7908Sometimes, pics do help...

That is exactly the graphic I was thinking of. See how the soldiers are at least '3 windows tall'. Does not compute.

Two words. Shrink rays.

It's like liquifying natural gas, just on fit for human use. Leave it to those crazy capitalists to see the efficiency gains from such technology.

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Nacey
G_Bison
Join Date 02/2008
+117
Reply #7910 October 21, 2012 4:09:12 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting GoaFan77,
reply 7910
Two words. Shrink rays.

Really, shrink rays..?Yeah, The Colony Frigate needs to be at least 50% larger in the above pic...

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Nacey
AgentExeider
Join Date 05/2006
+7
Reply #7911 October 21, 2012 4:45:32 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

when is this B going to be updated for Rebellion.

I want to play this S.

-Æ

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Nacey
StarFallArmada
Join Date 02/2008
+7
Reply #7912 October 21, 2012 6:48:43 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Its not clear that those are windows, they could be lights of any kind. Or maybe just small windows. But its beside the point anyway. I'm talking about the other parts of the cinematic  where it shows many of the ships in close proximity so that you can get a good idea of their scale. I set out to make charts of their sizes relative to each other, and I contend that using the in game engine to do this is valid, given that they seem to match how they look relative to each other in battle scenes of the cinematic. But i still would like to know the source of the idea that the in game ships are not to scale with each other, as I am always open to convincing  

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Nacey
TheChronicToast
Join Date 03/2008
+67
Reply #7913 October 21, 2012 8:08:03 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting StarFallArmada,
reply 7913
I'm talking about the other parts of the cinematic where it shows many of the ships in close proximity so that you can get a good idea of their scale.

Just keep in mind that this was ALSO from the cinematic ... where two things that were side by side were completely out of scale.

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Nacey
GoaFan77
Join Date 10/2008
+629
Reply #7914 October 21, 2012 9:05:57 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting StarFallArmada,
reply 7913
Its not clear that those are windows, they could be lights of any kind. Or maybe just small windows. But its beside the point anyway. I'm talking about the other parts of the cinematic where it shows many of the ships in close proximity so that you can get a good idea of their scale. I set out to make charts of their sizes relative to each other, and I contend that using the in game engine to do this is valid, given that they seem to match how they look relative to each other in battle scenes of the cinematic. But i still would like to know the source of the idea that the in game ships are not to scale with each other, as I am always open to convincing

The ships are scaled to each other. But they seem comically scaled to anything else, like planets, stars and the people from the cinematic. Thus while you could do a relative chart it's impossible to give a number to their dimension to compare with other Sci-fi series or real world objects.

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Nacey
Ryat
Join Date 06/2006
+429
Reply #7915 October 21, 2012 10:57:55 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting AgentExeider,
reply 7912
when is this B going to be updated for Rebellion.

I want to play this S.

-Æ

Soon. Sent an email to Nacey about it.

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Nacey
Twilight_Storm
Join Date 07/2009
+92
Reply #7916 October 22, 2012 3:52:25 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

The ships are not to scale to eachother.  Just look at the windows on the scout or protev.  Abd either one compared to HC or Capitol Ships is not in sink.

-Twi /)

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Nacey
Stant123
Join Date 02/2008
+193
Reply #7917 October 22, 2012 7:44:46 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting StarFallArmada,
reply 7906
What is your source that how they apear in game in relation to eachother is not accurate?

https://forums.sinsofasolarempire.com/172963/page/1/#1556877

Blair, one of the creators of the sins universe states fighters are 10 meters and the largest cap is a kilometer.  Comparatively, this does not equate in game.  Close, absolutely, but it just doesn't equate.

Then we have this post from Brad roughly three weeks later:

https://forums.sinsofasolarempire.com/175286/page/5/#1589301

He says the frigates alone are 1.2 kilometers.  Fascinating isn't it?

 

So we have 10 meter fighters, 1200 meter frigates, and 1000 meter cap ships...  I don't dare try to figure out the size of the cruisers.  Clearly the size of ships is left entirely up whom ever you listen to on the development team.  That being said, if there's no consistency between developers, how are we able to assume there is consistency between the ships?  Brad is full of shit since the math just doesn't ever work out that way so we'll just continue on while ignoring him.

 

So now we go back to my post using rational facts like the size of people and structures on the ships to compare rather then just accepting what we are told...  I computed the length of the trade ship to be roughly 200 meters.  Now compare that ship's length to the sova in game and you can assume roughly a kilometer in length for the sova.  So that supports Blair which means my methods and math are at least valid, however, if you use the same methodology to get the size of the sova based on the height of people and using recognizable structures like windows to calculate the size and number of decks in a certain area and thus give you a tangible number to work with for measuring as I did to compute the size of the trade ship, the sova only ends up being a little more then half of a kilometer long.  So comparatively, based on recognizable structures, this comparison proves the sova visually is 5 times longer in game, however mathematically it should only be two and a half times longer.  They fail the consistency test.

 

Quoting StarFallArmada,
reply 7906
but comparing how they appear in game to the cinimatic made for the rebbelion intro, they seem to match pretty well. In the cinimatic they look about on scale to how they are in game, and given that the cinimatic is suposed to look like somone had a video camera at the battle, Im not sure that the scale is actualy off in game.

Okay so let's just ignore the math on that previous example.  Let's use the pictures provided.  We can still assume the average person is 6 feet tall (just hair more then 1.8 meters).  The colony ship in the cinematic still provided by Bison comes out to an estimated 30 meters long (which is me being extremely generous since it does not look like it's the length of a football field, but I digress).  Likely smaller if you assume that visual distances would make the people visually smaller then the ship since the ship is closer in perspective to the eye, but I'm ignoring that. So if that ship is only about 30 meters, in game when compared to the sova, the sova ends up only being 120 meters in length (again, extremely generous)...  But that's just not possible if the fighters are roughly one fiftieth to one seventy-fourth the length of a sova.  I can't get a perfect shot of them on the same plane, but after 6 attempts I'll settle for the largest measurement, one fiftieth.  That makes the fighters 2.4 meters in length, a little more then half a meter taller then a man (roughly 2 feet)(but in actuality probably not even as tall as a man if I had an accurate picture from the cinematic to work with).  Name one fighter, terrestrial or not that is only 2 feet longer then a man is tall and packs in engines, fuel, life support, sensors, equipment (or most likely smaller then a man and still have all of that)...  Hell, the chair alone would take up most of that 2 feet...  So that creates a huge problem for you about the cinematic and a real simple suggestion from me...  The cinematic is lying, meaning all comparisons based on what is observed from the animated cinematic (which was not rendered using in game material/footage) and what appears in game is complete bull.  The two fail the consistency test.

 

So, three fails for consistency...  Need more?

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Nacey
StarFallArmada
Join Date 02/2008
+7
Reply #7918 October 22, 2012 10:54:03 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting GoaFan77,
reply 7915



Quoting StarFallArmada,
reply 7913
Its not clear that those are windows, they could be lights of any kind. Or maybe just small windows. But its beside the point anyway. I'm talking about the other parts of the cinematic where it shows many of the ships in close proximity so that you can get a good idea of their scale. I set out to make charts of their sizes relative to each other, and I contend that using the in game engine to do this is valid, given that they seem to match how they look relative to each other in battle scenes of the cinematic. But i still would like to know the source of the idea that the in game ships are not to scale with each other, as I am always open to convincing


The ships are scaled to each other. But they seem comically scaled to anything else, like planets, stars and the people from the cinematic. Thus while you could do a relative chart it's impossible to give a number to their dimension to compare with other Sci-fi series or real world objects.

This is all im trying to do. I understand that they are sevearly out of scale with planets, and it seems possibly out of scale with people (still not sure im entirly agree, but i see that much of the evidence is sound). All I am doing is making a chart of scale between the various ships, whch I still think at this point they are acuratly scaled with eachother, even if as an agregate they are out of scale with the rest of the game. @Stant you think way too deeply about this (bravo for that sir  ) and your measurments using the people definatly holds water that some of that cinimatic is lying (the part on the planet I belive) but I dont think any of your evidence precludes that the ships are to scale with eachother, which is still my only stated goal. But thank you for the information. I think we are all pent up here. When is the full rebellion update for DS comming out again?

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Nacey
Ryat
Join Date 06/2006
+429
Reply #7919 October 22, 2012 11:01:33 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting StarFallArmada,
reply 7919
When is the full rebellion update for DS comming out again?

Soon

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Nacey
AxelDude
Join Date 04/2011
+11
Reply #7920 October 22, 2012 11:15:15 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Ryat,
reply 7920

Soon

Can't help it..

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Nacey
Stant123
Join Date 02/2008
+193
Reply #7921 October 23, 2012 6:43:07 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting StarFallArmada,
reply 7919
@Stant you think way too deeply about this (bravo for that sir )

Well, you asked the question, I had an answer to it because I worked on the very same question over a year ago.    I just never made scaled sketches like I did with the trade and refinery ships.  I did those because I was planning on using them in the DS lore at some point before interest in it waned.  Someday maybe I'll get around to the others... 

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Nacey
StarFallArmada
Join Date 02/2008
+7
Reply #7922 October 23, 2012 4:48:21 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

I would enjoy seeing those. I'm interested in your take on the scales. 

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Nacey
Stant123
Join Date 02/2008
+193
Reply #7923 October 24, 2012 6:56:53 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Personally, I'd scale them to what Blair said not how they appear.  It's his universe.  If I have to fudge the drawings, then that's what I have to do.

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Nacey
Hegemon76
Join Date 05/2008
+2
Reply #7924 October 28, 2012 11:05:45 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Is the link for the download broken?

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Nacey
Hegemon76
Join Date 05/2008
+2
Reply #7925 October 28, 2012 11:20:04 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Humm ok got it to download and when I go to enable all it does is minidump .

 

 

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